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EP59 - The Left-Handed Path, Mystic Christianity, and the Somatic Spiritualist With Rachel Rae Halder

Updated: Apr 16

Intimacy, particularly with oneself, is a profound journey that can be both deeply rewarding and challenging to navigate, especially for those with past traumas.

Today, I have Rachel Rae Halder, a multi-faceted somatic practitioner, and life-long spiritual student. Together, we unravel the complexities of healing, breaking free from patterns, and embracing intimacy in its many forms. 

In this podcast episode, Rachel Rae Halder takes us through:

-Importance of intimacy, particularly in relation to self-acceptance and personal growth.

-The mystical side of Christianity and her experience of the interconnectedness of religion and spirituality.

-How she helps leaders, teachers, and healers break free from limiting patterns that hinder their growth and fulfillment.

-Her upbringing, experience with sexual abuse, and her profound spiritual awakening.

-How her approach to healing combines cognitive understanding, spiritual practices, and somatic therapies to facilitate deep transformation and self-acceptance.

-The power of self-acceptance: moving away from the cycle of needing to fix.

-The value of seeking to understand healing on different levels.

And so much more!

She is a writer, thought leader, coach, and guide in the trauma, somatic, and embodiment fields. She loves working with coaches, healers and leaders who’ve done all “the work” and yet still sense there are unseen life-degenerating and syndromal freeze patterns dictating their reality.

Rae is a seasoned practitioner, certified in over 10 different healing modalities, with a decade of experience with some of the most advanced trainings around trauma resolution, sexual liberation, and collective healing under her belt. She has a unique, mystical, and energetic approach to trauma healing + pleasure and a deep-rooted sense of the dark feminine path (a path of being and accepting, as opposed to a mental knowing and rejection).

Her work goes far beyond the typical somatic experiencing principles and enters into the nature and energetic or mystical realms of the unseen.



A: Every day, there is a forgetting, and every moment, there is the possibility of remembering. Remembering who you truly are, awakening to your body, to the inner world and experience of being alive. Here is where you find the beauty, the joy. Here is where you free your Soma. 

A: Hello, everyone, and welcome to Free Your Soma, Stories of Sematic Awakening, and How to Live from the Inside Out. 

My name is Aimee Takaya, and today I have Rachel Rae Halder live with me and we're going to talk about some really powerful, juicy, amazing things regarding intimacy, especially intimacy with yourself. 

Rachel Rae Halder works with leaders, teachers, healers who have been deep in the work of healing and yet feel they are still stuck or challenged by patterns that they wish to break free from. She helps provide relief from the constant cycle of needing to fix and moving instead towards full acceptance of self. Thank you so much for being here with me today, Rachel. 

R: Yeah, thank you for the invitation. It's great to be here. 

A: Yeah, so maybe you can tell us a little bit about where you come from, what your background is and how you came into being here today, sharing this amazing stuff. 

R: Yeah. Well, I'm born and raised in the Midwest in Iowa. I had a British father and an American mother, so I kind of had two different kind of cultural upbringings, and I grew up Mennonite in a small, insular Mennonite community, which is not Amish. 

Many people are like, wow, you didn't have electricity. I'm like, no, I had electricity. I wore jeans. Like, you know, I had like a somewhat normal life, but it was also, it was also like a little bubble. Like it also was very much this alternative kind of community. And yeah, I didn't remember it, but I had experienced sexual abuse when I was three years old. And then, when I was 22 years old, I re-remembered that abuse. 

And that instigated a healing journey for me. And it was interesting because I was already like a women's studies major, and like I was already very interested in these kinds of topics. I remember when I went to college and like, quote, unquote, discovered feminism, it was like, it blew my mind because it was like, oh my gosh, I felt these things. 

I knew these things, like all of this stuff. But then to have this kind of recognition at 22, I'm like, whoa, this thing happened to me, and it has impacted me. And when I first remembered that abuse story, like the thing that came out of my, like out of me was my whole life has been a lie. And that might seem like a strange thing, but it was just like, wow, I recognize, even at that point, not really even knowing much about healing and stuff. I recognize this thing really impacted who I am. 

And I actually don't know who I am beyond this thing. Like I could see how this thing that happened to me that I didn't even remember, like kind of dictated a lot of decisions, a lot of, you know, interactions with other people, et cetera, et cetera. 

So then from age 22 on, I started going to therapy for the first time and I just sort of like, this sounds weird, but I like fell in love with healing. Like I was just obsessed. Like I was like, this is so fascinating. Like I just loved exploring my psyche. I loved understanding like myself. I love putting together the puzzle pieces of my life and, like, you know, getting a full picture of everything. And this remembering my sexual abuse also led to a deep spiritual awakening as well. I had always been a mystic, and I'd always been very alternative. 

I would say like, even though I was like pretty men and I, I was always like fringe at the same time. And very much like when I was two years old, apparently, I declared like God, not a he got a she. So it was like, there was this like piece of me that was more on this mystical, like feminine, divine kind of track in life. But then I had this big spiritual awakening that kind of blew me open to this recognition of, whoa, there's like so much more beyond what I ever thought or knew or could see and like, you know, understanding energy dynamics and all these other things. 

And so yeah, I mean, there's so many components of the story, but the main gist of it, like the nugget for here is like, I started doing that healing work. It came to a point where I was like, the cognitive therapy isn't, I would, I don't know if I'd say isn't working anymore, but actually, my therapist was like, you're healed. And I was like, I'm not healed. Like, like, I still really struggle with intimacy. I still like have zero interest in sex. 

Like I can talk about my abuse like with zero reaction. You know, like I do feel like, oh, this thing isn't like looming over me in this like horrible way. Like, I don't feel like I have like PTSD in the sense of, like, it's like affecting me day to day, but like, clearly, it's still affecting my body. And so then that took me on this road of more somatic therapies, and would it be to heal through the body as opposed to just talk therapy and like speaking it out? So then, yeah, there's many, I'm like, how, how deep do you want me to go? Because this journey is very long. Let me pause it. And let's, let's wear that. 

A: Yes. Well, I think, you know, this idea that there's a wound that you re-experience later on that you realize has created so much of who you think you are that, you know, and one of my mentors, my somatic mentor said this to me earlier this year, and it was like, I had kind of known this, but I felt it more this time. He's like, so much of who we think we are is a collection of stress responses. 

And I was like, oh man, wow, you know, and even just the way that people, you know, use self-deprecating humor or have like a certain style or way that they posture themselves in society can all be related to a desire to be accepted or loved or protect themselves or all these different ways that we navigate in our bodies with all the conditioning that's there too, to do something for us. And we don't realize it, you know until it sounds like at 22, you had this opening, this realization that there was a lot more to you, a lot more potential and possibility than you had even realized because you started peeling away these layers of your identity. 

And what you said also about kind of getting to that point and talk therapy where, you know, and I had this experience too, for me, it was kind of like, I felt like I'm just sort of like running around in circles a little bit here and I'm not actually touching on like the thing that's really aching in me. And I'm getting really good at intellectualizing it and talking about it or even writing about it, but it's not entering me. It's not entering like my internal experience in a way that like I'm being called to. And I feel like, and I'd love to hear more about the types of somatic work that you found, you know because for me, I kind of feel like I just fell into it because my dad had already been exploring it and was kind of continuously inviting me to do this somatic work. 

And I was like, no, Dad, I'm doing my thing. Right. I was like resistant for a long time. But for you, it was a different experience because you're going into it with this like excitement and curiosity. And it got to be kind of like your thing, it sounds like initially. So maybe you can tell us a little bit about what are some of the somatic practices that you first discovered on this journey out of talk therapy. Yeah. 

R: I mean, honestly, you know, it's kind of that stereotypical, I don't know if it's stereotypical, but I feel like these days it kind of is like when I was 22, and I started going to therapy, I also went to yoga class for the first time. And it was crazy because in yoga, I just like burst into tears, and I was like, why am I crying? Like I was like so weirded out by myself and the behavior that I was exhibiting. 

And then I went back and the same thing happened. I was crying. And like, I think I went to like five classes where I just like cried the entire way through the class. But I think it was because there was so much, like, so much trauma in my body that was finally getting like an opportunity to come out. And so, like paired with the talk therapy, like somehow being in a yoga class that I don't even remember. I don't even think it was like super spiritual or anything. I think it was more just sort of like a chill, maybe more like yin style yoga. 

Whoa. Like even just like moving my body in certain positions or like maybe it was even just meeting myself in my body, like maybe being like landing in my body for the first time or even noticing, oh, I have a body. That yeah, it was just all the emotions were just coming out. But then, the more intentional work that I did. 

So when. So, I mean, it's kind of like twofold. So one thing is I went to grad school, which we talked about Claremont. And I ended up getting a master's of religion and I studied the intersection of neuroscience and spirituality. And like, what is the intersection of that? Like how does spirituality heal people essentially? But then I ended up writing my master's thesis on the suppression of sexuality in the Christian church and naming it a form of spiritual trauma. And so for that, I started really doing a ton of research into this. 

So it was kind of more a top down approach, like a cognitive approach where I was like studying it, understanding it. Prior to going to grad school, I had lived in an interspiritual community. And what that means interspiritual, it's different than interreligious because rather than like studying the traditions or like from like a theologian sort of like philosophy perspective, it was much more based in practice. So I began practicing different traditions. Like I would like do Zikr every Thursday night, which is like a Muslim Sufi practice. And like every Friday I would be in Shabbat. 

And I mean, like, I would sit in Peiwadi church ceremonies with Native Americans. Like the it was just it really was this inter-spiritual community. And the reason I was so curious about this intersection of neuroscience and spirituality was because I was like, that place healed me, like, not healed, period. But, you know, there was so much healing that happened there. But it was all just through spiritual practices, and like how and why did that happen? 

You know, I just I wanted to understand like I knew it on a body level, but I wanted to understand it on a more cognitive level. So that's why I went that route in grad school. And then simultaneously while I was in grad school, I first discovered Layla Martin's like jade egg course. And so I did that. And that was super potent and like wild and intense for me. And it really helped give me this like somatic understanding of like, wow, there's so much stuff stored in my pelvis and like stored in my postage and stored in my body. 

And like I could literally like feel it coming through. And then that year, I guess it was like the second year of grad school was when she launched her first sex, love, and relationship coaching program. And so then I signed up for that. And so then was in that simultaneously while I was in grad school. And then also simultaneously, while in grad school, I was like also studying like internal family systems therapy. And I was also doing some of the I haven't done all of somatic experiencing, but I was doing some of the first like portions of it. So it was sort of I was just like I said, I'm just like a voracious learner. 

Like I love, I love healing. I wanted to understand everything on every level. So I was just sort of like, oh, what's this? What's this? 

What's this? And simultaneously putting it into this thesis of like, how do people heal and how and why? And then especially in this context of like when it comes to spiritual trauma. How do people heal from that kind of influence? That's wonderful. 

A: I, you know, I think that the realm of somatics is actually this really powerful intersection of science and spirituality because people can study it and talk about it from a body level of, like what's neurophysiologically going on about, like the brain patterns of trauma and things like this. But it also includes our human experience. It's not purely a biological practice or a biological realm of study.

It's also studying what are we personally internally experiencing. What is the lived experience and how does that interact with our biology? How does our perception interact with our biology? So I think like, you know, this intersection of understanding, you know, the theological realm and bringing in that question of how does this actually work on a brain level? 

I think that that is a very like it sounds like you got a very somatic graduate degree. Even though it probably wasn't called that, it was its own. Oh, yeah. 

R: Yeah. It felt that way. Yeah. And I think coming straight from living like in the middle of nowhere, New Mexico, on this mountain in this intentional like hippie community, and then going straight to guide school, I think it almost like had to be that way. Like, I don't think I could like do the traditional route just because that experience, like two and a half years on the mountain, was so non-traditional in so many ways. And yeah, it was a really fascinating experience to go from like experiencing it on a somatic level to then understanding it on a cognitive level. 

A: Yeah, that's beautiful. I think that you know, I don't think that some people even know that these kinds of communities exist, you know, that someone could be doing these different spiritual practices from different religions and having their own personal spiritual experience within those practices, you know, without, say, like a priest or, you know, some authority, which is usually how most people experience religion without an authority, kind of like making them choose and saying, like, you have to just be this thing and you can't be all of these things. 

You know, what was your personal experience coming from having grown up Mennonite to having kind of this smorgasbord of different things that you were allowed to experience in this intentional community? Like, were there times where you felt like you were kind of in an old way of like thinking you had to choose, or did you feel this sense of freedom? 

R: I really felt the sense of freedom, but that was just more like my personality, I think. I've never been like a super like dogmatic person. So, for me, it just felt like freedom. Like it was just like a relief. It was just like, oh, wow. Like and then also on top of it to have these different experiences and practices feel so deeply healing, like chanting Islamic prayers, like chanting an Arabic, I would have like profound connection to God. And it was just like, wow, like I had no idea that, you know, me chanting, oh, oh, oh, over and over again, could like create this like super deep divine experience or like once I was doing a hermitage, and I wasn't even like I wasn't really a big Ram Das person. 

I didn't really even like I'm even blanking on his teacher's name, which feels like a disgrace or something. Baba people listening if they know they know. But I was doing this like hermitage, and like I had a visitation from like his teacher who like came to me and like spoke to me and like gave me a whole transmission or like also actually the whole reason I went to grad school. And I mean, this is this is getting, you know, pretty out there. 

But these were some of my experiences. It would just like open me up on such a deep spiritual plane. But I was in a Shabbat service, and it was in celebration of a man named Rabbi Reb Zulman, and he was really big in the intersection of connecting Judaism with Islam, and he was really core in a lot of like peace meetings in the Middle East and yeah, like really bridging the gap. Like he was both a sheikh, like a spiritual teacher in, I think, the Sufi lineage, and then also a rabbi, and he passed. I didn't know this man. Like I heard stories of it, but he's the one who brought Shabbat to Lama Foundation. 

That's the name of the community that I was in, Lama Foundation. And so he was the one who encouraged us to practice, you know, this is 30 years ago, Shabbat every Friday evening. And it was definitely like reformed Judaism. 

It was not like traditional at all. And then we call it like kind of Lama style Judaism. But then while like while I was in the Shabbat service that was in celebration for this rabbi, he literally, like again, I had a visitation from him, and he said, why aren't you doing what you should be doing? And I was like, what should I be doing? Like I was so confused, and he was like, you know what you should be doing. And then I was like, I don't think I do. 

And he said, like you need to go to theology school and actually like burst into tears. I was like, waping in the middle of this Shabbat. And there was like at least 60 people in this room were all sitting in a circle, and my really close friend was sitting next to me. 

She said, why is it going on? And I was like, I'm having a really supernatural moment right now. But it was like so bizarre because theology school was like not my radar at all. At that point, I was actually had kind of a lot of like anger toward Christianity or like frustration. I'd had a really traumatic experience with the Mennonite Church. 

I think that exact summer that this visitation came to me. So I was kind of like done with that stuff. You know, and then this rabbi Shaq is telling me to go to theology school. Yeah, I don't even know if I just answered your question. I'm kind of like, I mean, there's so much there. 

A: There's so much there we could explore. So like you're talking about this rabbi who literally was merging these two supposedly opposing religions, right? And he was initiating you in healing your wound with Christianity. I mean, that sounds pretty profound that he was like, where's work for you to do here because of who you are? That's what I got. 

R: Yeah, that's totally what it was. And like talk about inner spirituality. You know, it's like his spirit. I to this day, I'm like, I don't know why he came to me. Like I wasn't in his lineage at all. Like I barely knew, I knew of him. 

I had never actually met him. But his spirit, you know, for whatever reason, my openness in that Shabbat service, like his spirit, was there. And yeah, it was like, do this thing like this will create more peace in the world. Like you, healing this trauma will help others and create more of the peace that we want in the world. 

A: Right. Well, here you are, kind of exploring all these other spaces of religious-like practice. And it's almost like he's calling you back to, like now take this note, this knowledge and bring it into what you grew up with, bring it into what you know in your body that is that is unhealed, that is aching. 

Like you said, you were having a lot of anger about the church at this time. And I just think it's so beautiful. It's such a beautiful story. And I think what you just said when you have that openness, and you just allow wisdom and, you know, teachers to come in and inform you, they can come from all over the place. It's like it can be, you know, I've heard talk to people who talk about having experiences with, you know, aliens on different planes of reality who come to them because there's an openness that they're presenting. 

And they get this really powerful information that shifts, you know, their trajectory, which it sounds like is exactly what happened. So, let's dive a little deeper into that in terms of going to theology school after having been in this intentional community. How did you start perceiving Christianity differently than you had when you were younger? 

R: Wow, yeah. I mean, like I said, I always had a pretty alternative view of Christianity as much as I could within the context that I was in. But I was always questioning authority. I was always questioning why we were doing things. Like, I was kind of like the bad kid because I would go to Sunday school and be like, but why, but why, but why, you know, like it just didn't or like it just didn't make sense to me. 

A lot of things are just like, this doesn't make sense. And then I went to a Mennonite college, but then it was in with my advisor who was like, I think you need to study women's studies. Like she's like, you have a lot of questions, and I think that'll help. And then she also encouraged me to do an independent study on the feminine divine when I was in college. So I also did this like huge semester long research project on, like, what's the last feminine in Christianity and in the church. 

And so that was really profound, too. So I'm just naming that because, like, I definitely was not a traditional Christian by any stretch. I don't even know if I would have called myself a Christian. I was like, Jesus is dope. I'm into him like I love God. I know I'm not an agnostic. I know I'm not like an atheist, but like I can't get behind what Christianity is. So I didn't know what that made me. 

Like I was just sort of like, what am I, you know? So then going to the community was super healing, I think, for that part of me, because it was like, oh, I can believe in God. I can be tight with Jesus. 

I don't have to label myself as a Christian. Like there is a possibility to explore in all these different realms. And it really, I would say that community is like very mystically minded. 

And so it really helped that like mystic in me, like be at peace. And so then going to grad school was fascinating because, I mean, the school I went to was very, very interreligious and very open. Like there was like a school of Islam on campus and a Judaism school, and Christianity. It was like a Methodist school. 

So there was a lot of openness to that. And then I took a lot of classes on Buddhism. And then also the school was focused on process theology, which is a very. 

How would you describe it? It's very not in traditional Christian theology. I'll just say that it's sort of like the, you know, it's like the quantum physics of Christian theology, which I'm super into. 

And I was like, wow, I didn't even know there was like language for this. But it was kind of like everything I was when I was there, I definitely was seeing everything through a very specific lens. And I was seeing it through this like mystical inter-spiritual lens. And I think some people just thought I was like the biggest weirdo ever. 

I mean, I wouldn't say I think I know that some people who is this girl on campus, I think some people thought I was sort of a loony bin hippie. You know, they were just like, what the heck? Like she's so ungrounded. But what I found so profound was like, oh, actually, this like school is giving me a grounding in all these teachings that I experienced. And so, like I felt like it was really grounding it. And I am a very intellectual person. And so it was just so cool to, like get the theory and to see the understanding behind the how and the why and the what have happened to me in those two years on my foundation. Amazing. 

A: Yeah, it sounds like you kind of deepened your understanding and you allowed it to kind of be you went from there or something very experiential to something actually a little bit more structured and mental. And then that gave you like a like a bigger picture of all of it. You know, as you're speaking, I'm you know, I'm thinking about my grandmother and my mother because you probably learned about this. 

It's also a kind of little-known realm of Christianity that I think you actually just touched on for a moment, the Rose Accrucians, and the way that they interpret like the Rose Accrucian teachings is that like they talking about the multiverse. Like they're talking about like this layered reality that we're in. And they're you know, they're talking about it through these like kind of ancient mystical texts that sound like a poem or a story, but they're actually describing things like a supernova. 

They're describing things that we have scientific names for in this real like in this time frame. And I think that many people don't realize that there is mysticism within Christianity and that there is, you know like you said, a quantum realm of this stuff. Going back to what you said about, you know, the studies you did on the lost feminine and in so many ways, like kind of connecting back with like the neuroscience. I feel like we have lived in such a like left brain dominant world that when we talk about feminine rising, I often think about allowing the right brain to come in and synthesize with our experience, you know, because there are going to be people out there who are, you know, for example, they say like left-handed folks are right brain dominant, maybe, maybe not, you know. 

Or we'd have to study them individually to be able to really tell that, you know, but ideally, like, you know, ideally as humans to be well coordinated, to be able to read and write, do all these things we want our brains lateralizing and working together and right and left hemispheres, not, you know, one's not overriding the other, but that they're collaborating on whatever it is we're doing, whether it's movement or whether it's like, you know, making choices or, you know, feeling into our living experience and deciding what to do with it. 

You know, so when I think about like feminine rising, I think about inviting more of that flow back into our body and into our experience and stepping away from this like rigidness and need to control and analyze and fix, you know, which is a theme you were talking about too. But I'm curious, like maybe you can speak a little bit more like the things you learned about the hidden feminine within Christianity. Can you speak on that for a moment? Because I feel like we're kind of in this juicy topic with Christianity and it'd be fun to add that in here. 

R: Totally. I'm like trying to like rack my brain because that was, um, how many years ago? I mean, that was 16 years ago now. But, uh, yeah, I mean, for me, I would say the thing, like, it's hard for me to remember the details. I had lots of details, you know, like I wrote like a 20 page paper on this thing. 

But for me, I'd say the way that it's impacted me currently in my current life is that I feel like I have a very strong relationship with Mary Magdalene, with Mary, with even like Anna, who is the grandmother of Jesus that has come through on a lot of mystical teachings. You know, many people would say that's bullshit. That's not true. But like many separate people who have nothing to do with each other, like would channel Anna and like Anna would come to them and visitations and speak to them. And she was actually, you know, I believe it had a really deep impact in Jesus's like mission and teaching in the world. 

Like she was a huge part of it. And so for me, I've had this like deep, like prayerful, you know, just like people like talk to Jesus, like I talked to them. Like, I'd say they're like my main people who I'm like, yo, can you help me out here? 

Like, what's going on? And I feel like a very strong and deep kindred, like almost like, like ancestral connection to them. And whether that is true or not, I don't know. But, like in my body, it feels very much like, no, I come from that lineage. Like I come from the Mary Magdalene lineage. 

Like that was the impulse at two years old to be like, God, not he, he got a she. Like it, there's such a depth in me. And I feel like in my DNA around what that feminine path is. And from that study, I mean, I went way back, like way before Jesus, too. And just looked at like the sort of the erasure of the feminine in like all through, even in Judaism, like before Jesus came around, but then also how it like in retrospect, there was a massive erasure of the feminine. But how like Jesus is like my, my understanding and my, you know, beliefs based on that study that I did is that like Jesus was actually bringing like a very feminine path. Like he was actually bringing this very alternative, very subversive, very radical way of being that actually was a very like more Yin style of being. 

I think a more embodied way of being; I think a more mystical way of being. And it just got really corrupted and hijacked by the church, you know, the like quote unquote, like 300 years later when they put it all in writing. And it was like literally used for government propaganda. They're like, OK, how do we take all of these teachings and literally use it to control people? And it's like, I think actually at the core of like Jesus teaching, he actually, I mean, and, you know, some people would probably say this is ludicrous, but like I believe he was like on a feminine path. Like, he was on that like left-hand path for sure. 

A: I totally see that. I mean, when you even just think about the basic teachings, you know, love another is yourself, nonviolence, you know, the ways that he promoted, like, you know, not complete nonviolence. Jesus actually was actually demonstrating very good boundaries. If we want to talk about like that, you know what I mean? 

R: He allowed himself to be pissed off. 

A: Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. You know, but in general, this theme of it, it wasn't he didn't have a conqueror's mindset. He was a peacemaker, you know, and generally speaking, we might describe that as a more feminine form of governing is to be someone who is looking for resolution and peace and also this theme of surrendering, you know, surrendering and just saying like, I don't know everything. Like I surrender like my power to like a higher source, and I like let go of this need to be perfect. Like all of that, I feel like is in the major themes of what Christ can teach us. Totally. 

R: I mean, even thinking about, like, why he was killed, like people are like, oh, he died for our sins. I'm like, no, he died because he was radical, because he was like so threatening to the powers, like so terrifying. And, like, what's the most terrifying thing to the powers? 

Feminine power, you know, like the upholding of these like alternative ways of being and ways of structure. Like I've read some things that even said, like he actually had 16 disciples and they were he had equal women and men as disciples. And like that whole aspect has been completely erased. But like there weren't just male disciples. There were actually female disciples, too. 

But, you know, I the way I see it is I'm like, no, he was like such a major threat, not because he was like the patriarchy like he was a major threat because he was like the opposite of the patriarchy. 

A: Right. Yeah. I love that. I mean, I totally agree with you on that. I feel that and it's not even something that I regularly verbalize or even talk about, but hearing you talk about it, I'm like, that resonates. Like that feels true to me in the sense of what I, you know, what I've known about Christ and Christ consciousness and the whole path of, yeah, of being fully connected to our humanity and connected to our divinity. I mean, many religions actually talk about the female body, you know, and the fact that we create life in our bodies. 

I mean, men have their own version of this, but that's this innate thing that we have in our bodies to connect, you know, to the heavens and be here on earth, like bleeding and, you know, going through all the human bodily functions that we go through. Right. Maybe this is a great time to actually segue into what you spoke about earlier and one of the themes for today's conversation in terms of intimacy and also what you mentioned about the way that many religions have vilified sexuality and sexual expression as, and maybe it's another way that they control us. Can you say a little bit about that dynamic and that kind of the impact of that as well? Yeah. 

R: I mean, I think when, when spiritual teachings and like when a more mystical path does get, I don't know, like turns into dogma or turns into a doctrine, turns into what we call a religion, it becomes about rules. It loses the embodied aspect of it. 

It loses the choice, the agency, the nuance, the flexibility because it becomes a regimented like this is what you have to do. This is how you have to behave. This is how you get into heaven or wherever you're going. You know, this is how you're a good person. 

This is how you're a bad person. And so, you know, I didn't grow up in other traditions, but I can, you know, I read enough to like witness that this does happen beyond Christianity, but I'll just name like for me, it wasn't even that like there was a lot of like sex is bad, though that was like the undertones of what I grew up with. But there was actually just like massive silence around it. Like we just didn't talk about it. 

Period. It was like it just didn't exist. Or, you know, if we wanted to talk about it, it was like, well, read this book, and you can read about it. And so a big, you know, a big piece for me, both having the sexual abuse experience. And like, within the sexual abuse experience, what I started recognizing was like, it wasn't just the sexual abuse like that's not what my trauma is about. 

My trauma is about the silence of sexuality, period. And what that did to my, you know, three-year-old, four-year-old, five, you know, as I kept developing brain about what happened to me and how that was so bad and so wrong and how it was a sinner and how like I go to hell and like all of these things because of course, I like internalize the experience. And then, like, going into my younger years and actually being a very sexually curious person and like getting into sexual situations that weren't the best for me, but that like I was just wanted to understand I wanted to know, like, I've always been this person, like who has to live through experience. 

And like when I want to know something, I like go hard into it. Like I'm just like, okay, I gotta like figure it out, gotta understand, gotta experience it. And so I was doing these experimental things, but there was so much silence and so much shame around it and so much like condemnation. And that in of itself was actually so much of what my trauma was. It was like this constant belief of like, I'm a bad person. 

These things that I do are like horrible things. And it's like, how easy is it? Like, like when I think about this, I'm like, if I wanted to control a big population of people, the thing I would do is disconnect them from their body, like disconnect them from their own knowing, disconnect them from their like sense of self, disconnect them from their own communication with God. Like, yeah, how like, that's a perfect way to control a group of people. 

Like just give them a bunch of dogma, a doctrine, give them a bunch of rules, and disconnect them from their own foundational sense of self that says like, this is who I am. This is how I can operate in the world. Like this is my self-trust within my own being. And I think that's at a foundational level, at least in Christianity and probably many other traditions. Though again, I don't really wanna say that if I don't know it for a fact, but it's like, it's like there's just such a destruction of like self-trust because you're taught to like trust the authority, trust the Bible, trust the text, trust all of these outside sources. And what makes you a more compliant person than to just constantly be trusting outside sources and not your own interior knowing. 

A: Right. And then the question of how is it that we get disconnected from our bodies or how do you disconnect someone from your body? Sexual trauma is a great way to do that. Violence, war, physical harm, sexual harm to other people. 

Trauma in general, disconnects our brain from our experiential body. And then to do that, that's the role of the conqueror, right? To come in and like ravage the land and ravage the people and traumatize the shit out of them for a couple of generations. And then to place their model of what they think and feel, what they're allowed to think and feel. And now, this is the rule book. And if you step outside of this, you're wrong and bad, right? 

And that's a perfect model of how to control people. And that's why the realm of semantics or sematics as a healing modality is not only so powerful because it reconnects us to our body, right? And it's, I mean, when we're talking about trauma healing, I think that you can't have full trauma resolution without a somatic approach. You can begin that process, but you can't actually resolve things without bringing someone fully back into their body to feel and experience and know what that's like, right? 

And so to go back to kind of these different spiritual practices that you were involved in, you can go through the motions. Somebody could be just chanting Allah and Allah over and over again and not have it as a somatic experience. Somebody can do yoga, and they're just doing it like a workout and they're not actually connected to their body, and it's not a somatic experience. And they're looking at you crying, going like, what's her deal? I've never cried during yoga. You know what I mean? So it's kind of how? The how is the way we get into our body, right? It's not just what we're doing. We can go through these motions. 

We can be part of a religion or have the nomenclature, have the words to describe it, know a lot about it, but the experience, that's where the changes are actually made biologically that become more of who we are. 

R: This is like such a juicy topic. Like where it's making me think is actually, so this is like again, some portions of my story. So I said, like, I did the Sex, Love, and Relationship coaching program, which was a deeply somatic program. It was like tons and tons and tons of practices and like somatic practices like literally was like self-pleasuring in these different contexts and ways for at least like 30 to 60 minutes a day. Like it was intense. It was a super intense thing, but what actually ended up, it ended up blowing me out. Like it ended up actually, it was too far outside of my capacity, outside of my like window of presence, window of tolerance, or using nervous system lingo words. 

And I had a massive crash after doing that program. A piece of that is also because one of my trauma patternings was achievement. Like achievement was my way of like coping in the world or feeling my own sense of self-worth. 

And so I approached that program from the achievement mentality that I had had my entire life. But it was such an, so I constantly was overwriting my boundaries with zero awareness around it at all. And so then that's what actually, so then I went into this massive collapse, had like massive health issues, totally shut down, like just complete like syndrome chronic freeze response essentially because I was approaching that from such a hyper like fight or flight kind of response. And so then that took me on deepening my work even more in the somatic trauma resolution. 

Like feel, I don't know if you want to stop, feel, yeah, thank you, because it was just like, wait, what is happening to me and how did this happen to me? Because in my mind, I was like, but I was doing all these somatic practices, and they were so good, and they were so powerful, but like getting back to what you were saying about like, actually it's not just doing the practices, it's actually doing them in a way that is in alignment, that is in coherence and that like with yourself and that is within your own capacity of what you can actually do. 

And so people often, especially from a Western mentality, and like this was totally my mentality, was like, the bigger is the better, you know, the harder is, you know, if I can do it 60 minutes a day, like surely I will exponentially heal. And it was like, no, actually that exponentially eventually should have been like back, like it actually- It could be in the other direction. It could be in the total opposite direction. And honestly, at this point in time, I'm grateful for that because I feel like that has given me a lens and like a perspective and also like my own work in the world and my own style of coaching is like, so opposite of that push energy, it's so opposite of like, bigger is better, it's actually like, no, how can we just be even 1% more connected to the body? 

What does that even look like? And can we pause with that? Like is like micro movements create the big expansion, or micro-movements actually lead to the quantum leaps? But we shouldn't start with the quantum leaps which so many people want to do, you know, they come into it being like, I want the quantum leap. And it's like, well, let's start with the micro-movements. Yeah. 

A: It sounds like you kind of, in a way, you got retraumatized, and that can happen with somatic practices very easily if you don't have someone, you know, because a lot of times that, you know, also what you said is like, we don't know where those boundaries are in ourself. That's part of the process is learning how much is too much and we often learn that by overdoing it. 

R: Yeah, if we're dissociated from ourselves, it's like, well, how on earth would we even know? Like I had no clue how much freeze I had in my body around my sexuality. So I was like doing all of this, doing. I was like doing, doing, doing, doing, doing, doing, but that didn't make the freeze actually go away. All it did was like a couple of traumas on top of the freeze. 

A: Yeah, yeah. I mean, the realm of like muscle contractions and micro-movements is like my wheelhouse. Like that's what I spend all of my practice doing is I work with people to really slowly unwind musculature using their motor cortex through micro movements. And, you know, oftentimes, you know, especially if someone comes to me and their focus at first is like chronic pain. And this, I think totally relates to what you just described. Like they're like, ooh, there's this pain in my hip or in my back. 

And while we're doing work together, there's this pain in my back, and I don't know whether the pain lessons and the pain lessons, but it hasn't quite gone away yet. And it's almost more annoying now that it's not quite gone away yet because they know it could go away if they just did something more, right? And I, and so I will often like, you know, to realize that this person like they want to fix it. They want to have this energy of achievement. They want to get through and like, you know, complete this thing. 

Like it's going to get them something when they finally complete it. You know, whether it's like, you know, a sense of relief or it's, you know, having feeling like they're healed or like they did it, wherever that kind of, like you said, like a stress or trauma pattern of achievement. And that's like one of the ways that you, that you get it right, right? Or that you overcome, right? And that's, it's sometimes hard because I'll have to explain to them your nervous system may not be ready to let go of this. 

And that's okay. You have experienced relief, right? It started out this big pain that was all over your lower back and your hips. And now it's just this tiny, like you're describing it like the size of a quarter, you know? So, like you have made progress. Like there is change, and we need to honor that your nervous system may not be ready to let go at the, to this space, whatever's going on there, whatever memory or situation, you know? 

Like your body's not ready to let go of this during this session today. And that we can accept that that's okay. Like it's sometimes very hard for someone to accept that, you know? And maybe you can talk a little bit about now like this way that has healers, teachers, leaders, people who've been on this journey for a while. That can be a very strong pattern in us to feel like we need to fix it. We need to heal all the way. Yeah. 

R: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I would say like a big like core piece of my work is rather than, and it's kind of what you named like, rather than finding fault in what our body is doing, where is the natural intelligence and what our body is doing? And that's hard to do because if we're having, you know, a destructive, like I have, like chronic digestive issues. It's really hard for me to look at that and be like, oh, there's natural intelligence and like my chronic digestive issues. 

But the reality is there is. And when I can actually pause with that and go into them and be with them and sit with them, it's like they're speaking to me about how I had such a lack of energetic boundaries, how there was such a lack of even like physical boundaries, like how I would digest other people's trauma constantly over and over again. And it was kind of like, oh, we're actually protecting you. Like we're actually trying to keep you from this constant cycle of what this is. And so I don't have to love it. I don't have to, you know, but I can validate it. 

Like there's a difference there. I don't have to be like, woohoo, chronic digestive issues, but I can be like, this makes sense. It makes sense that these chronic digestive issues are here. Or it makes sense that I have, you know, this lack of intimacy. Oh, it makes sense that I don't find my partner attractive. You know, a lot of people come to me, they're like, this is a problem, you know? And so, like, say someone comes to me about like, oh, I have a lack of attraction to a partner. 

They're like, can we fix it? You know, like, can you give me some practices? Like, can I get my turn on? And I think a lot of people, like at least what I've seen in the coaching industry, will kind of come at it from that place of, okay, yeah, let's do this pleasure practice. Let's do this, let's do this, let's give you all these things to do to fix this, like lack of sexual desire. 

And I'm like, actually, can we just pause with this? Where is the inherent intelligence in this? What is this trying to speak? 

You know, where is, what is this actually the wisdom in this thing that is so annoying? And in that process of looking at it in that way, we're actually de-shaming it. Because when we come at it, we're like, this is a problem which is actually a shame. It's, we're saying this is bad, this is unwanted, this isn't good. And when we're constantly seeing ourselves and our body and these experiences as bad, we're actually getting ourselves into this cycle of like constantly trying to fix and never actually meeting the thing that wants to be fixed. And people spend lifetimes in those cycles. 

Like they could literally spend their entire life there or they could spend years there. And so my approach is actually like, hey, like, let's slow it way down. And let's actually pause with this and slowly pull out the little tendrils and the little pieces and find the nuggets of wisdom in it. And it's in that self-acceptance. 

It's in the validation of it. It's in the care towards it that then ironically, those things start loosening. And they're like, oh, maybe I don't have to hold so tightly. Maybe I don't have to like, you know, do this thing. Like it's like, that is actually what happens for then the release of, or like that's when the relief is brought in of the pattern. 

A: Yeah, I love that. Then looking at these symptoms, you know, or these problems that we're having as information that are in there, that are in somatic intelligence, is giving us about, you know, why is it that you may not be feeling intimacy with the person? Maybe there's something that happened. 

Maybe there's a boundary that was crossed. Maybe there's words that you need to express or say that you haven't been saying, you know, and that's what, you know, it's showing up as like the example you gave, like a loss of attraction to your partner. But what it's pointing to is something deeper that's going on inside of you, you know, or inside the dynamic of the relationship that is asking for some kind of healing, is asking for some kind of attention, right? And often, you know, when we just do, do, do, we're just, we're trying to get rid of the symptom. 

Like you said, we're trying to fix it and like, okay, let's just get this over with and move on. And there's something underneath of that, which is what you're talking about. There's something underneath of that, that when we even just start to touch on it and talk about it, and like you said, take out those pieces, it starts to unwind itself, which is really magical and marvelous. Because it's getting actually addressed, the pain that, you know, the symptom that we were trying to get rid of, the actual thing underneath of that is getting heard. 

And kind of going back to this theme of like, you know, that it wasn't the actual instance of abuse, but all of the intense silence around it, and the silence that you like created in yourself around it for so long, that actually did most of the damage, you know, it's that, you know, holding back and not speaking, not expressing, not, you know, sharing what's happening internally, that in so many ways, tightens all of those knots more and more. So maybe you can describe a little bit about like some of, you know, like if someone works with you in a session, or I know you have like some different programs that are more long form, which I think is a great application for somatic work. 

You know, if someone's going to embark on a somatic journey in their body, I think you need a like long-form kind of approach because you're not going to get it all in like two sessions, and you're certainly not going to get it all in like a weekend intensive. It's going to open some doors, maybe, but it also could just like be way too much, right? So maybe you can talk a little bit about, you know, how your approach works in form, whether that's a program you've created or how you work one-on-one. Yeah. 

R: I mean, in terms of one-on-one, I always say like my work is very client-led, meaning that I'm listening to their body, I'm watching their limits, like I'm deeply attuning to them and where they're at. So, you know, some clients we can do like really deep, energetic, somatic work, maybe even a lot of our sessions are silent, or they're, you know, these deep like underworld, like experiential journeys, almost shamanic in nature. 

Whereas other people, it might be a little bit more like top-down, like talking, like getting education, getting like the, like I have a client who it's much more like, for her to heal, she needs the like scientific understanding of the how and the why. And so a lot of it will be actually teaching that like, okay, well, let me draw you a nervous system map, and let me explain to you what's happening for you. 

And like that when you hit this point, this is what's happening. So it's like a much more like theoretical way of doing it with little somatic bits, but also like recognizing the capacity for one to be in that somatic energy. So for certain clients, they might only be able to be in like the actual like, be with their body somatic field for 10 minutes. Other clients can sit there for 90 minutes and we can do these deep wild journeys, neither is wrong or bad or good or right, it's just where they're at. And so in terms of one-on-one work, usually people come to me, I do minimum of six month container. 

So usually people come to me because of something, and I will create like a map at the beginning of our work together, like a sort of like a meta map. Okay, this is like where I see you're at. These are sort of the core things that I see us like working towards. This is like the journey I see us going on. And just like any map, there could be like 13 ways to go to get to the destination. It's not like a rope. This is what we're going to do to get there, but it's giving them context and like a container to enter into of like, okay, there is like a way, it's not just a mystery, like there is actually a way to get there. And the way includes so much mystery and so much nuance. 

When it comes to more group programs, like I have a program called Slowburn, which is a five month long container. Like the tagline before was like transforming trauma into turn on. So it is a sexuality based program. And it's really about, I mean, it's really about what we're talking about. 

How do I actually transform my trauma by understanding and accepting my trauma imprints and creating space then for the blueprint of health, like to come online, online, like the blueprint that's already living inside of my being to come online. And so in that context, it is a bit more of a top down approach where it is a bit more educational. Like it will be more like drawing out maps, really explaining and like taking it in, like I have four modules throughout that program and really intentionally being with each portion of like, okay, how does this work in the body? 

And then each module also has a coaching call. So then there is a little somatic component where it's like, okay, you know, maybe only 20 minutes each person, but like we'll do a little piece, show you a little bit how this goes. But then also in the context of teaching, there might be a somatic piece, you know, like someone might bring something up and I'm like, okay, do you want to go there in your body and then we'll do a little piece. But I think that's a big thing that I think we miss a lot is like, at least the way I look at trauma work and the way I hold trauma work is that like, so much profundity can happen in a 10 minute piece. 

And like we don't like, I'm a big lover of like 90 minute sessions, but it's also insane what I can do in like a 10 minute trade with a colleague. Like I'll literally do these, like where we'll like have a half hour and it'll be like, okay, 15 minutes, you're inside person, I'm outside person, like inside being client, outside coach or whatever you want to call practitioner. And then like reversing and it's wild what you can actually do in a 15 minute window. 

And when your body knows that that's okay, what is the most doable piece that we can do in this window? So yeah, for those longer term programs, there is kind of more of a top down approach, but there is also the somatic aspect and the experiential aspect where you get to experience this work. And then there's also just like a transmission that happens through the education as well. 

Like that's what I've experienced with teachers and that's what I've been told people experience with me. It's like when your body knows it on such a deep somatic level, there's actually like a transmission that happens. And I've had a lot of people in my classes who are like, I've studied nervous system for like four years or you know, I've done all this work, I've done this, I've done that, but somehow hearing you say it, it like lands in my body. And I'm like, that's because I have like a deep somatic understanding of this concept. 

A: And they're co-regulating with you, they're actually nervous system to nervous system, even over zoom, you can get that you can get that feeling that energy of like where you have gone in your own body and the capacity. I mean, I think about this a lot when I think about the tissues of our body and like the neural pathways and how so much of this somatic work and these practices build new pathways and build this like endless system of, you know, information that's coming down from our spinal cord from our brain into the tissues and into these different areas of our body. 

And we can create those pathways just by self sensing, we can create them by moving, we can create them by breathing, you know. And so when you are a person who has done a lot of this work in your own body, just by being in your presence, it's that transmission you're talking about, other people will can their nervous system can feel that and can start to mirror that can start to build some of those pathways that they didn't even have to literally experience the knowledge differently, which is what you're describing. 

And I think that you know, this is again this merging of, you know, we hear about these spiritual experiences where, you know, someone goes to see like a spiritual teacher and the spiritual teacher like looks in their eyes or like touches them and they're like healed, you know, and it sounds like this miraculous thing, but it's actually a nervous system thing. 

It's a nervous nervous system transmission of what it's like to experience, you know, quote unquote, enlightenment, you know, or this wider view of what's happening this macro view, where we can see that we are innocent, where we are where we are not, you know, bad, wrong, you know, damaged, whatever the like belief or the, you know, society or the conditioning would inform us of where we can kind of step out of that and see the larger framework. Totally. Yeah, it's such an amazing program. 

I love that you're taking some of the didactic stuff into because you have so much to offer in that realm. You've done so much studying and so I'm sure it's just like a very rich environment for people to tap into because you can kind of like draw from a lot of different practices. Do you do that? Do you kind of like synthesize things? 

R: Yeah, definitely. I absolutely do that. I do it in different ways in different spaces and different programs, but yeah, it's kind of like how could I not? I mean, I guess maybe some people aren't that way, but I'm kind of like it's hard for me to even separate what's what, you know, like I often try to give credit to like my lineages and like really try to say, okay, I learned this concept from this teacher, I learned this concept from this teacher, but so much of my work is like a blend of like 10 different teachers. 

And it's just like, here's a list of like all the people I've learned from, but I can't always even separate what's what, or even like, you know, I might have learned a concept five different times, but finally with one teacher it landed, you know, so it yeah, it is very much a widespread of everything. 

A: Yeah, and I think that there's value to like both styles and ways of doing things, you know, there's different forms of like yoga or even body work where people can be really purists, like they're like, this is the protocol, this is the way this is the style, you know, that like we teach or that we do. And that's that's beautiful in its own way, because then it kind of preserves that way of doing something so that people can come and experience that way of doing something like vipassana meditation, for example, you can go there and get like this real deal, like experience, you know, but at the same time, someone's going to go to that vipassana, and they're going to have this personal experience, and they're going to be able to see how the past meditation synthesizes with the other things they do. 

And so there's beauty to being able to innovate and take that like, you know, tradition or that practice and bring a new spin on it. I think they're like both really important styles, like one's not going to be better than the other, it's going to be part of that same dynamic of like preserving like what what a teaching is, like what this means, you know, like a word in the dictionary, but then coming up with all these new uses for that word, playing with that word, using it in different contexts, you know, creating new words from that word, you know, totally. 

Yeah, very, very true. Cool. It's been just absolutely such a pleasure to talk with you today about all of this, you know, is there anything that you feel like at this moment really called to like, like a final point or something in you that's here to be expressed today in regards to kind of all the things we've talked about or maybe something new that's coming forward that you'd like to share? 

R: Let me tune into it and see. I'm like, really, but let me let me drop in and see. Yeah, I think it's just like the encapsulation of everything is like, like if your healing work isn't working, it's because it's not healing work, it's fixing work. And yeah, if I just like, it's like, I just, my heart cares so deeply. And I think probably because this was my own journey where it was like, I was just stuck in that realm for so long, that seeking that searching that like needing to fix without even realizing it, you know, it was just like, Oh, maybe this thing will work. Maybe this thing will work. 

Maybe this thing will work. And yeah, I wish at some point. And I mean, I don't know if I wish because it's like, well, my journey was my journey exactly the way it needed to be. And I'm here teaching exactly the way I need to. But one of the things I like to offer to people is like, if the healing work isn't actually healing you, it's not healing work, like it's fixing work. And let's pause, let's actually slow down, like let's take a break. 

Because that could actually be the most healing thing. And then in that break in that space, where can we find more self-validation? Where can we find just more okayness? And I feel like so many of like, the issues that so many of the people I, you know, work with or I'm with, it's like, we're just not okay with who we are in the here and now, like we're just not okay with where we're at in the journey. Like I have a lot of people who come to me in like big life transitions, like kind of like the made-in-a-mother journey, like they're in this phase of like, Whoa, I'm not this person anymore. 

But I don't know who this person is. And like, this is confusing or chaotic or depressing or like, whatever it is. And a lot of the like, turmoil in that is this, where I'm at is bad. 

This like idea of where I'm at is bad. And so much of what society tells us is there is a right way. And so really finding like maybe the way I am or the way this current way is, is my right way. And that doesn't mean there aren't patterns that I can work with or there aren't ways I can make my life easier or create more relief for myself. But that relief often doesn't come from being like, I am wrong. Like, I didn't even say often, I've never seen the relief come from the belief of like, I am wrong, or this is bad, or I need to fix it. Yeah, it comes from actually going in and being like, what if this all makes so much sense? And can I sit with that sense-making? 

A: I love that. That's, that's so beautiful. It's music to my ears, because I think that I also spent a long time trying to, to fix myself trying to, you know, get that pain or that discomfort to just go away already, you know, and it, you know, what you've described is that we, the okayness, and I like that word for it, because we also can get very stuck in this idea that to experience feeling good is to experience like a heightened state of our nervous system, or to have like a boom, like a pow, like a, a pythym, like a, you know, you know, rocket ship. 

Yeah, a high point. And what you're describing and what, you know, a lot of somatic work brings us to is actually like this reduction in stimulation and a reduction in our stress. And that is actually much less sensational at first, right, that boom experience. 

R: It's actually boring. Like I was like, this work might feel boring to you. Like, I do tons of like stabilization with my clients, which is like, where do you feel stability? Where do you find it in your space, like in your body, in the nature, everywhere? And I'm like, this is probably the most boring practice you've ever done. Like honestly, like when you first come to it, especially if you come from like a place of doing high expansion practices, it's going to feel like what? 

What is this? Is anything even happening? Right? Yeah, like what the heck? But it's actually what I've seen over and over again, is that it can be the most transforming practice. 

Yeah. Just being like, Oh, is there a bone in my body that's stable? Where is it? What does it feel like? Can I hang out with it for five minutes or 30 seconds or five seconds, if that's all I could do, you know? But just recognizing, Oh, there is some sense of stability here, even if it's only 5% of my reality is still here. 

A: Yeah, I love that you come in with the word boring and just like say it outright to people, because that definitely comes through in my work too, because people come with this idea of like, Oh, you're going to physically release like this tension and this trauma from your body. And then what ends up happening is they just feel better. They don't have this like, you know, boom experience there. 

And it's not like a hot yoga class where they come out with like all these bursts of brain chemicals, they come out and they're just like, Oh, I'm relaxed. And well, isn't that kind of not special and special at the same time? It's not special because it's just, it's, you know, how I've described it is like, it's like sunshine on your skin. It's like the wind blowing. It's like a friend giving you a hug. 

If you're not tuning in, you can miss it. It can just like pass by because it's so normal or mundane or boring in a way, you know, but when you, when you really learn and build that capacity to be with those boring things, it can become so beautiful and magical. And you can start to really appreciate how special being relaxed and calm actually is in this world. 

R: Absolutely. 

A: Yeah. Well, thank you so much. If anybody wants to get in touch with you and they want to hear more about your work or they want to, you know, learn more about your programs, where's the best place to reach you? 

R: Yeah, people can follow me on Facebook or Instagram. I also kind of have a TikTok, but I mostly just post about books on there. I'm a big book-talk person, but Rachel.Rae.Halder and Rae is spelled “RAE”, halder is “HALDER. That's my Instagram handle or slash Raehalder; all one-word RAEHALDR or my website is also And on there you can, it's, my website is pretty out of date. Sometimes, I'm kind of embarrassed giving it, but all my recent programs have program pages, and people can check them out and see them there. Or email at

A: Beautiful. Well, I have to say one of the reasons I reached out to you is because of your beautiful and expressive writing on your Facebook. And so if anybody's, you know, going to follow you and read your content, they're going to be in for a wonderful treat because you really, you know, you write these long-form beautiful poetic, you know, self-expressed kinds of things.

And, you know, it's kind of like that same thing we were talking about, like nervous system to nervous system, it comes through in your writing in the way that you express yourself. And so people can really start to get a feel for like where you are in your journey and, you know, where even where you've come from, you bring in these pieces of your past and you, you know, you're very good writers. I'm very impressive. 

R: Thank you. Yeah, I love writing. It's like, I sometimes like feel like I am more writer, like I'm like, almost more a writer than a coach. Like it's weird, but thank you for naming that. I really appreciate it. Yeah, feels delightful hearing you say that. 

A: Wonderful. Yeah, well, definitely to all of our listeners, go check out Rachel and her offerings, connect with her to learn more about this incredible journey that she's been on and how that can start to help you unwind and discover what your somatic intelligence is telling you because it's there all the time, right underneath the surface, your body, your soma is speaking to you and it's speaking to you in these unexpected ways that maybe like we've talked about today, you might find annoying or difficult or unpleasant or boring or what not. But it's a communication. And I think that in so many ways, your conversation with me here today has demonstrated that and the power of that to transform our internal experience. 

R: Absolutely. Yeah, thank you so much. 

Outro: You've been listening to the Free Your Soma podcast to find out more information about today's guest; check the show notes. And to find out more information about me, Aimee Takaya, and the Radiance program, visit 

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